New Forum: Hidden Variables

[Schmelzer]

A new forum for those interested in foundational research in physics has been opened at http://ilja-schmelzer.de/forum/. It is named "Hidden Variables". The name already indicates the main topic: Hidden Variable theories or interpretations of the theories of modern physics.

Hidden variable theories are outside the mainstream, and discussing them is, therefore, unwanted or even forbidden in many mainstream physics forums. This makes it necessary to create a forum where these theories can be discussed.

On the other hand, hidden variable interpretations of the leading theories are, as physical theories, as viable as any other interpretation of these theories, so that such theories are legitimate part of modern physics. It would not be a good idea to discuss them in a forum which is full of cranks and supports arbitrary "alternative science", simply because this would discredit the serious scientific theories by association.

So, while the forum is open for the discussion of alternative theories of physics (non-physical "alternatives" like 9/11, moon landing, intelligent design and so on are forbidden), their proponents will have to show the viability of these theories, their compatibility with modern physics.

The personal reason to open a forum to discuss such theories is an obvious one: I propose such hidden variable theories myself. These theories are not mainstream, but sufficiently close to it - they have been published in peer-reviewed mainstream papers, and give the theories of modern physics - general relativity, the standard model of particle physics - as their limits. And this is what those who propose alternative theories have to reach too, if they want to survive in the forum. So, this forum will be in no way supportive for cranks simply because the admin favors some non-mainstream theories.

[FrediFizzx]

Hi Ilja,

Good luck with your new forum. But it is hardly necessary since a very simple and physically logical hidden variable was discovered in 2007 that produces the QM prediction of the EPR-Bohm scenario in a local-realistic way.

Plus it was also presented on this forum in a few different ways that Bell's theory is false. Basically due to mis-interpretations of the inequalities. To this day, QM and the experiments still use different inequalities from the Bell inequalities to show their so-called "violations". Nothing has ever truly violated any Bell inequality.

[Schmelzer]

If you have to present a hidden variable theory, you are invited to present it in the forum.

A subforum for the discussion of Bell's inequalities is also there at http://ilja-schmelzer.de/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=7

Of course, there is a condition: politeness. Personal attacks will not be allowed.

[FrediFizzx]

Perhaps if you get some more members we will show over there why Bell's theory is false quite easily as we have successfully shown here.

A word of advice; the spammers already know how to defeat the image challenge with their bots for registration so you will eventually get a lot of spammers trying to register. Use a more involved question and answer system that only a human could answer for registration.

Plus you will find out that politeness is not so easy to maintain if one is to allow intense discussions that actually mean something. I even allowed some rudeness from you on this forum. You will end up being like physicsforums.com that you were banned from. Join the club; I was banned by them many years ago and is a reason why I started this forum.

[Schmelzer]

Its your choice if and when to propose your ideas.

The first spammers I have already had when the forum was completely new, linked nowhere, not even from my own website.

I will try to enforce politeness, and see how easy it is to do this. The discussion have to be not about something, but about physics. Intense discussions about physics are certainly possible without starting personal attacks. Or do you have seen some personal attacks in the Einstein-Bohr discussions or so? There was a time when I have moderated a forum with political content, at that time I have allowed almost everything. I think for a scientific discussion this is not appropriate, and the polite way which was obligatory in scientific discussions of the past is part of scientific culture, a part which is in danger of getting lost.

Of course, the enforcement of politeness has to be consistent, one cannot allow the own side to be rude and enforce politeness from the opponents. Even polite people will, after some attacks which are not moderated away, start to react with tit for tat.

The problem with Physicsforums.com is not that they enforce polite behavior, but that they do not allow some non-mainstream content, even if politely discussed. BTW, the ban was obviously only a temporary one, until they have decided what to do with my announcement about my forum, I'm no longer banned there.

[FrediFizzx]

Politeness would be wonderful but I just don't think it is in human nature to always be polite especially in heated discussions. We tend to use very minimal moderation on this forum so that it can be somewhat like the sci.physics UseNet group of yesteryear. Basically the only thing we don't tolerate too much is overly repetitious commenting (a version of spamming). And of course profane language. I would like my grand-daughter to be able to read this forum.

For physicsforums.com what I meant was you will be like them if you start rejecting posts and banning people for any reason. We give members two warnings about "spamming" the forum if other members complain via "Report this post". If they continue after that then they are banned.

[Schmelzer]

What I actually plan is to moderate not by banning but by explicitly deleting any personal attacks, leaving the other content unchanged. Not sure if this works, but I will try.

[FrediFizzx]

If you have to present a hidden variable theory, you are invited to present it in the forum.

A subforum for the discussion of Bell's inequalities is also there at http://ilja-schmelzer.de/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=7

Well folks, we took Ilja up on his invitation to check it out and I have say that we can't recommend his forum. Lots of dishonesty and he simply ignores facts that he doesn't want to accept when the truth stares him right in the face.

It is kind of ironic since Ilja is an etherist and the last thing you would think is that an etherist would believe in "spooky action at a distance". But he does, so that fails his ether theory right then and there. He will of course try to rationalize it in some way but it just comes down to believing in magic. His "MO" has been pretty much the same for years now and if you are interested you can click on this link to see it.